John Fetterman was furious.
The Democratic senator from Pennsylvania was ready to speak A disaster response press conference in Bucks County On July 16, 2023, just hours after a flash flood in Upper Makefield, Pa., resulted in seven deaths. Local officials spoke for a few minutes to offer an initial update to the assembled press. Later, govt. Josh Shapiro informed about the work done by his administration to respond to the emergency situation.
After a few minutes, Shapiro returned the microphone to local responders, not Fetterman. A few minutes later, the event ended without Fetterman speaking.
Fetterman, already deeply suspicious of Shapiro, has vowed to appear at events with the governor, three sources familiar with the matter told NBC News.
A source said Fetterman “did four or five rounds of prep on the show for this.” “And [Shapiro] it just went completely beyond it. After that, John [said]: ‘If there’s an event where he’s going to be there, I don’t want to do it.'”
The episode highlighted what has become an increasingly volatile relationship between two of Pennsylvania’s most ambitious elected officials. This is a Democratic Party rivalry that is suddenly in full view and has the potential to shape state politics and even the national political scene for years to come.
Earlier this month, Vice President Kamala Harris was finalizing her search for a running mate and He was thinking of Shapiro among his final choices, This was reported by Politico Fetterman’s aides told Harris’ team that the senator had concerns Shapiro. Days later, at a Philadelphia rally where Harris introduced Minnesota Gov. Tim Walz as his No. 2 candidate, Fetterman sat cross-legged as Shapiro gave a rousing speech. , 6’8” Fetterman was singled out as the lone member who cheered and didn’t join in the cheering for Shapiro.
“It’s very well known to most PA politicians that the two collide,” said one Pennsylvania Democrat. “It was clear that these two were always on a collision course, and the only thing that kept them apart was that they went to different offices.”
“Almost airing our dirty laundry,” the person added.
The news conference incident last year is not the first example of Fetterman backing away from events with other officials, according to two people with direct knowledge of another episode. In the early days of the pandemic, Fetterman, then lieutenant governor of Pennsylvania, attended a daily staff call with top officials of then-Gov. Tom Wolf administration. Wolf told Fetterman to calm down after bringing up criticism of how Wolf’s employees run state-run liquor stores and tweets suggesting the administration has failed in its coronavirus response. Fetterman later stopped appearing on the calls, both people said.
NBC News spoke with 12 people familiar with the Fetterman-Shapiro relationship from various perspectives, most of whom were granted anonymity to speak candidly about a sensitive subject involving two powerful figures. No two elected officials in Pennsylvania have seen their fortunes improve or their national prominence rise more under Donald Trump, rising from the county commission and small-town mayoralty on opposite sides of the state to become the state’s most recognizable political heavyweight. As Pennsylvania became the biggest swing state on the map.
“Like Oil and Water”
Both seem to have future presidential ambitions, but also unique paths to the top of the state. for Fettermanhe ran unsuccessfully in 2016 as an aide to Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., before winning a lieutenant governor campaign championing marijuana legalization and criminal justice reform. He won the Senate seat in 2022 after a campaign in which he suffered a stroke and was sidelined for months.
Shapiro’s rise up was more methodical, serving as a congressional staffer, state representative, county commissioner, and state attorney general. before winning the governorship. Along the way he passed Other Democrats who split the vote with him and made headlines for fighting Trump’s efforts to overturn Pennsylvania’s 2020 election and for his investigation Sexual abuse in the Catholic Church.
“It’s like oil and water,” said one person familiar with the relationship. “They are very different people. Western PA vs. Eastern PA. Button-ups and smooths and hoodies and I shoot s whenever I want.”
Fetterman and allies Both pointed to a controversy while serving on the state’s Board of Pardons the origin of their disintegration. As lieutenant governor, his role on Fetterman’s board was one of the biggest parts of his job, and he considered his work there one of the most important of his career. He and Shapiro, then the state AG, disagreed on some clemency recommendations, and at one point, Fetterman he did what he saw as danger He will run against Shapiro for governor in 2022.
A person with direct knowledge of the matter said Wolf, who was in charge of the state at the time, had to intervene in the dispute after Fetterman “forced some sort of meeting.” The person said Shapiro felt he had incomplete information about the cases he wanted Fetterman to support, and that Fetterman repeatedly pressed for approval of the pardons.
Many people said the confrontation was about more than Fetterman venting his anger on Shapiro, especially because the senator took public steps — sitting while Shapiro spoke at a rally and talking about his controversies on the state parole board. – To express his displeasure, although not Shapiro. Two unrelated Pennsylvania Democrats have separately compared the trials to a popular meme from the hit TV show Mad Men. Here, a man standing in an elevator criticizes the show’s protagonist, Don Draper, to whom he replies, “I don’t think about that. You usually do.”
“I don’t think Josh is running against Fetterman,” said Larry Ceisler, a Democratic public affairs executive in Pennsylvania and a longtime observer of both men. “I think Fetterman has an obsession with Josh.”
“I wouldn’t be surprised if John Fetterman, like any politician, thinks he might run for president one day,” Zeisler added. “He probably thinks Josh is a potential rival. … I’ve never heard Josh talk down or negatively about Fetterman. Never.”
Still, some said the case goes both ways, adding that the amnesty episode is only a small piece of the fuller picture.
“It’s just two guys who hate each other,” said a second person familiar with the relationship. “This is old-school political competition. It’s nothing deeper than that, it’s just an old-school, cross-state political rivalry between two young up-and-comers who both want to be president.”
“They have a very personal animosity,” said the first person familiar with the relationship. “And it’s not just a one-way street, it goes both ways.”
‘It’s really bad’
During Fetterman’s speech at a Harris-Walz rally in Philadelphia last week, his apparent displeasure with Shapiro caught the attention of those sitting next to him, a person close to him said. Shapiro received a standing ovation when he said he would “pour my heart and soul into serving you every day as governor” and “work to ensure that Kamala Harris and Tim Walsh are the next leaders of the United States of America.”
Describing the Fetterman-Shapiro relationship as “like oil and water,” the person said they were worried that Fetterman’s lackluster response would suggest that Harris was unenthusiastic about the campaign, which was not true.
“You have a crowd of 12,000 screaming their lungs out for Josh Shapiro, and John is going to make a statement there,” he said.
Speaking on MSNBC the day after the rallyIn response to questions about the Politico story, Fetterman said he “never directed” aides to advise Harris’ team of concerns about Shapiro, and he said the center of his dispute with the governor was their state on the Board of Pardons.
“I don’t understand why we’re talking about a choice that’s already been made,” he said, trying to get past the storyline after Walz’s choice, adding:[W]why are we talking about these strange things?”
Shapiro was pressed on the subject on the same day told reporters: “I’ve never played small ball. I won’t start now.”
Reached for comment for this article, Shapiro’s office referred NBC News to the governor’s public comments last week. Fetterman’s office declined to comment on the relationship between the two men.
Some Democrats who spoke to NBC News expressed concern that the beef could hinder the state party’s general election efforts, though others said it would not make a noticeable difference at the top of the ticket.
“We are all committed to electing Kamala Harris and Governor Waltz as Vice President for President of the United States,” said State Senator Sharif Street, chairman of the state Democratic Party, adding, “Look, I think Senator Fetterman is a man who speaks his mind and will continue to do so. “I’ll tell you, I think he’s going to play a big role in making sure that Vice President Harris and Governor Walz become president and vice president.”
Since being elected governor, Shapiro has been known to take a more active role in helping Democrats campaign than Fetterman, which in turn has earned him more goodwill among elected officials in the state. His poll numbers also beat Fetterman. shows multiple requests.
Then there was Shapiro’s rise to national prominence in the Democratic veepstakes.
“There is a different version of this reality [Fetterman] He could have been Kamala Harris’ running mate in the conversation,” said Fetterman, who described Shapiro as close to “oil and water.”
The two men were not always at odds. The Associated Press reported on this In 2022, Fetterman held a 2016 fundraiser for Shapiro at his home in Braddock. When they shared a statewide ticket two years ago, combined for a supported coordinated effort by national Democratic campaign organizations. But in the final days of the 2022 campaign, the pair made several appearances with each other.
“I’ve never seen them talk to each other,” said Dan Miller, a Democrat from Fetterman’s home state, who said he ultimately could not talk about their relationship.
Democratic insiders also expressed little hope that relations would improve, as they said it would benefit the rest of the party in Pennsylvania.
“It would be great if it wasn’t a problem,” said a Democratic strategist in Pennsylvania. “It’s just bad. It’s really bad.”
There’s Shapiro and Fetterman almost never appeared at the same event Press conference led by local officials since July 2023. Shapiro spoke out because his administration was involved in the state’s response.
During his speech that dayThis moment “calls us all to come together,” Shapiro said. He also thanked Fetterman for his participation.
When the press conference ended, Shapiro walked past Fetterman on his way out of the room. The two paused for a brief exchange. Then they went their separate ways.